via our email contact form. Find out the differences and similarities between the 4L60E and 4L80E transmissions with information on how to swap them. There should be 13 pins in the electrical connector. Fits 1993-15 4L60E, 4L65E, 4L70E There are a few problems that often show up over time. Or, save time and money with a. For the purposes of using with the LS PCM there are some compatibility issues you must be aware of. COMPUSHIFT Sport is delivered with versatile factory-set programming for a wide variety of transmission and engine combinations. Overall it has lower gear ratios as well as an overdrive gear leading to better fuel economy and less wear on the engine over time. my signature linesnot really directed at anyone in particular.. A forum community dedicated to hot rod owners and enthusiasts. WHAT ARE THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THE VARIOUS 4L60E/4L65E/4L70E TRANSMISSIONS? Early style, .490" dia., increased ratio, O-ring style. TCC PWM solenoid). Please complete the fields below to send your friend a link to this product. Includes 16 pins and 10 cavity plugs for unused connections. Jun 23, 2014. . For units with 300mm converter, non-reluctor style shaft. Electronic control transmissions are different from manual transmissions. Now the question is which one do I want to put behind a 400+ hp L33 when I put it in my Xtreme? Small bell-housing 2.2L 4cyl. Durability suffers in higher-load applications where more energy goes into the clutch during the shift. Corvette Servo. Join to discuss rebuilds, modifications, tech articles and more! Interesting that the 4L65E is just 10 ftlbs less, and the 4L70E actually surpasses the 4L80E in torque capacity from the factory and that the 75E is just 35 ft lbs less than the 85E. Many people wonder about the 4L60E vs. 4L80E transmission differences and if these two can be used interchangeably. This makes it very fit for use in trucks, SUVs, jeeps, and even muscle cars. $500 plus new GM front and rear carriers only. This is a PWM transmission. Sonnax servo kits include instructions for setting servo travel between .075" and .125" using a dial indicator. You know that the 4L60E is shorter than the 4L80E. Diesels have a peakier torque curve and you want to be able to increase throttle without the torque converter unlocking immediately. Damage to the band, input/output shafts, sprag, etc. TCC lock-up solenoid is normally only energized in 4th gear, if the transmission temperature is above 250F it will energize it in 2nd and 3rd as well. On a gasoline engine which has a relatively flatter torque band, you can unlock the TCC to multiply torque. The number of bolts that both contain is also different. Any extra slippage in the torque converter at highway or cruising speeds is energy wasted, and the Torque Converter Clutch (TCC) lockup allows for a direct drive from the engine to the transmission. During a 3-2 downshift, the duty is decreased and this duty is related to the vehicle speed; lower speed, lower duty. Any little differences from year to year in the 4L65E that make one year more desirable for an LS swap? LS based bell-housing with 7 mounting holes, Casting # 24206952. Multi-pin connector and no TV cable RPO on bellhousing is "M30" Trending Pages. If you are using a Gen IV (58x) engine, the preferred transmission would be from a 2007 or newer application. Installing Sonnax parts designed to work together is the best and safest way to upgrade any transmission. ENGINE Connector In first gear, at approximately 13 km/h (8 mph), the OEM ECU pulses the LUF (aka. For '85-later units with 298mm converter, 30-spline input shaft. This type of pump only moves the fluid necessary to achieve the pressure and flow needed in the transmission. Bushing Kit to OEM Spec. Whether youre starting from scratch with a heavy duty/performance build or optimizing a seasoned racing vehicle, the following key areas MUST be addressed to realize the full potential of these units: *Also available separately under Part No. What would it cost for you to build one and ship to me? AllCOMPUSHIFT Sport4L60E transmission controllers are supplied as acomplete plug and play assembly. The Pulse Width Modulation (PWM) torque converter clutch solenoid, which comes on all late models of the 4L60E, allows a smooth application and release of the torque converter clutch, and the adapted valve body which is controlled by electronic actuators and solenoid, makes the 4L60E easily controllable with a modern electronic transmission controller such as the COMPUSHIFT. 4L65-2ACM 2003-15 Type 3. Broken drive shell / sunshell. Check the transmission for bent or broken pins in the connector. TRANSMISSION 6 Causes & Repair Cost. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. There's a 17-pin case plug as well but it's only used with the 4L70E which has the internal mode switch. Damage to the band, input/output shafts, sprag, etc. The way that both transmissions work is the same. None of the above categories describe me. Install a new sprag assembly that includes new inner/outer races. They are both meant to control gears and are used in GM vehicles. Earlier GM transmissions used a fixed displacement gerotor pump that regulated pressure by bleeding off excess fluid. MegaShift has a line pressure sensing/logging function built it. The 4L65E are selling for $500 up around here but its a gamble, rather put my money into a rebuild. A worn TCC regulator valve causes an oil leak and this prevents the TCC from engaging, leading to slippage. However, the amount of fluid needed is different between the two. These harnesses include the Gen II LT1/LT4, Gen III (24x) LS1/LS6 and Vortec Truck Engines as well as Gen IV (58x) LS2, LS3, LS7, & Vortec and GEN V LT / ECOTEC3 Engines. 1st design 3-2 valve 1995: Stand-alone year! Will The 4l60e Transmission Wiring Harness Work Without A . I was covered from head to toe in old dirt stuck to my new, seemingly perminant layer of atf. These come with the spacer and input shaft needed to work with the specific converter. Stage 2 4L60E/4L70E/4L75E (09-UP/17 Pin Connector) Z-Pack Hi Energy Clutch Set 3/4 with Kolene Steels. Will not interchange with any other year. I have a 2016 Silverado. Choosing a selection results in a full page refresh. If the transfer case doesnt have a speed sensor, there are aftermarket kits to add an output speed sensor. VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. 1993 to 2015 General Motors vehicles equipped with the 4L60E, 4L65E and 4L70E automatic transmission often have a worn-out accumulator piston pin bore or a broken plastic accumulator piston. M-F 8:00 AM to 4:00 PM PST Aside from the upfront cost, you must also factor in all of the expenses to make the new transmission compatible with your vehicle. The 4L80E is the electronic overdrive transmission that came from the TH400 lineup. These, 20 Years Later: Whats New with 4L60-E PWM Modifications, Guard Against 4L60/E Band & 3-4 Clutch Failure: Test the 3rd Accumulator Checkball Assembly for Leakage, A New Trick in the Bag: Additional 2nd Gear Servo Size for the 4L60-E, 4L60E Performance & Heavy-Duty Transmission Build Guides, Harness that Horsepower! It's a 0.5-4.5 Volt output (accuracy &plusminus;5 psi), and has just a three wire hookup: It has a 1/8 NPT fitting - the same as the transmission port. I changed the title of your thread to let folks what your question is. Best practice is to always test drive a fresh installation with pressure gauge installed to verify: This feature often is completely disabled, even though leaving a little on will help maximize driveline durability without slowing the vehicle. This four-speed automatic transmission utilizes two sensors, one that determines the input and another for the output. So, when replacing the external wiring harness of your vehicle's 4l60e, you must consider the number of pin connectors. Large bell-housing for the 90 degree V-6/V-8 with 6 mounting holes, Casting # 24206579. Below This trans has always given me problems (3 rebuilds in 3 years) so I found a GM performance 4L70E at a good price but it has the 15 Pin connector. Product Support The 4L60E can come with either the 13-pin or 15-pin case plug. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. then there is quite a few wires from harnesses which i need to know the purpose and how vital they are to make the trans perform correctly. 3. It helps prevent air ingestion during hard acceleration, which can destabilize transmission pressure and lead to slipping. Never leave out the 1-2 checkball. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. The 700-R4/4L60-E family of transmissions is the most popular performance platform in the world, thanks in large part to Sonnax components that allow them to run reliably at extreme power levels. A better programming option is disabling the EC3 continuous slip, while keeping the pulse-width modulated (PWM) TCC apply so that the converter clutch comes on in a ramped, controlled manner. 1 piece TCC control valve in the valve body. The transmission is known for its good fuel economy. The 4L80E driveshaft isnt the same length as the 4L60E. PLEASE NOTE SOME 2006 4L65E TRANSMISSIONS HAVE 15 PIN'S SO PLEASE COUNT YOUR AND MAKE. The switch contacts are normally open and close when fluid pressure causes them to. OEM vs. Aftermarket Parts: Differences and Which is Better? *** The 3-2 Sol is pulsed at 50 Hertz, 0% duty in 1st, 90% duty in all other gears. in 93 4l60e was introduced using shift solenoids and pcm (computer) for up shifts. 4WD or 2WD application? can be reduced by properly cushioning the large ratio change on the 1-2 shift: Reduce ratio change by converting 1st Gear from 3.06 to 2.84 with Sonnax input carrier kit. We run you through a quick survey to determine exactly what plugs and cables you need for your specific 4L60E transmission and it's specific application.You'll get exactly the right kit. You must keep this in mind before you swap out the two. The sunshell is susceptible to break on the 4L60E. The weak OE backing plate flexes during clutch apply, allowing heat to build up unevenly within the clutch packs limited space. Duty cycle on the Pressure Control solenoid is inversely proportional to the throttle angle (as throttle angle increases, duty is decreased). The 4L65E utilizes 5-pinion planetaries, along with a hardened input shaft, that boosted torque capacity to 380 ft.lbs. If you push in on your servo cover, you'll notice that it moves in around 1/8"-1/4". Product Description. This also used a 27 spline input shaft with the tipped end that has an o-ring in front of the splines. It is a common weak point that results in no 2nd, 4th and reverse gear. My owners manual states that I don't have to shift down for towing any more like with earlier models which had the Drive, 3rd option on the shift indicator. There should be 13 pins in the electrical connector. TRANSMISSION STARTS OFF IN SECOND GEAR, WON'T SHIFT ON IT'S OWN, BUT YOU CAN SHIFT IT MANUALLY? TH350, Muncie, Powerglide, T-10, Saginaw, TH200, A4LD 4R44E 5R55E Rebuild Kits, Parts & More, 4L60E Torque Converters (1999 & Up) 300mm, 4L60E Torque Converters (1993-1998) 30 Spline, 700R4 2004R External Lock Up Kit Instructions, A518 Lock Up Wiring Instructions (46RH Only), 700R4 Stage 1 "The Exterminator" 400HP (7004-R 700R-4 TH700 4L60), Stock 4L60E 4L65E OEM (98-05) No Core Charge, 700R4 "The Nemesis" Stage 2 500+HP (7004-R 700R-4 TH700 4L60), 2004R 200R4 Transmission Performance Stage 1 450HP, 4R44E, 5R44E, 5R55E Master Kit with Frictions, without Steels; Fiber Pan, Stage 2 4L65E/4L70E (06-09/15 Pin Connector). This can be identified by counting the metal pins sticking up from the round electrical connector on the transmission. Burnup is the common result. For units with 300mm converter, reluctor-style shaft. For a '94, yes your friend is right you need a non PWM(pulse width modulated) tranny. Monster Savings of: $77.48 (55%) Availability: Product Available. JavaScript is disabled. The main differences between the 4L60E and the 4L80E transmission are the weight and size. Fits 1993-15 4L60E, 4L65E, 4L70E. OEM: 4L60E 4L65E 15369267. These are Delphi Micro-Pack terminals. These are: The wiring inside the 4L60E transmission looks like this: The corresponding AMPseal connections for the control/sense functions are: The CAN termination resistors are already in place on the MS-II controller and GPIO board. The plate has holes in the plate, marked in the diagram below. There is one gasket with 17 bolts on 4L80E models, while the 4L60E pan contains 16. Product Description 4L60e or 4L70e to 4L80e Plug and Play Adapter This adapter is for 2007-2009 (15 Pin) Transmissions If you have a 1998-2006 Transmissions and some 2007's with a 13 PIN connector see part B3100 The AN A49 ADAPTER FOR 2007-2009 (15 pin) with the EXTERNAL Gear Select Switch on the driver side of the transmission. It features a length of 26.4 inches and weighs 236 pounds. Unfortunately, you cannot use the 13-pin connector if your wiring harness has a 16-pin. The 4L60E is an electronic transmission that comes from the 700R4. SKU: Accumulator Pistons Category: 4L60E, 4L65E, 4L70E. HGM COMPUSHIFT Sport - Check out what Specialists from Down Under say! There are presets already included for gasoline and diesel engines, and within the diesel category, you have two broad categories: low-speed diesels and high-speed diesels. The transmissions use a separate connector for vehicle speed, and in the case of the 4L80E and later 4L60E variants, input shaft speed. A Race Winning Brands Company. To wire the 4L60E transmission to the GPIO board, you need to make a number of connections: (This circuit only works with 'Shift Button Polarity' = "active low".). If the mode switch is open, pushing either the upshift button or downshift button will put you in manual mode (and pushing both OR switching the mode select switch to auto will put you back in auto mode). The number of bolts that both contain is also different. I am interested in enhancing my vehicles performance. Condition:Remanufactured. 700 was re named 4l60 shifts where determined via t/v cable and governor they used computer for lock up only. While there are many differences, the function of the two remains the same. If you take out the 4L60E and try to put in the 4L80E, you must make room for it. On sale $1,495.00 $1,395.00. Max. A worn Torque Converter Clutch (TCC) regulator valve. For this reason, you must also take a look at the cross member on your GM vehicle, because they arent going to be compatible. It has an 11-pin case connector. Toggle menu (844) 298-6404 Does not have PWM cast into the front pump. Guarding against 3-4 clutch failure has traditionally meant working within the limited space of the OE input housing. "I do have two builds running low 10's (they say) on the street", $500.00 for a genuine 4L65E core is on the cheap. You must know the various gear ratios if you plan to swap the transmissions. They are: Failure of the 3-4 clutch pack. It also provides a lot of torque in the first gear. It came out in 1993 and ran until 2012 (limited with Colorado's/Canyon/Hummer). When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Can You Swap the 4L60E and 4L80E Transmission? These also used a short stator front pump. Thanks for the education, very informative. The 4L60E uses 4-pinion planetary carriers, these carriers are rated to 360 ft. lbs of torque. The PWM came in for the '95 model year, and was changed again for the '96 model year again. As with all transmissions, the engine is linked to the wheels for controlled movement. JavaScript is disabled. You might prefer to look for a special adapter kit. I'm guessing it's 94, making my blazer a 95 tranny???? http://www.transmissioncenter.net/700r4.htm, http://www.hotrodders.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/37081. You can't tell the difference between a 700R4 and a 4L60E by the oil pan as they are nearly the same. 1993 to 2015 General Motors vehicles equipped with the 4L60E, 4L65E and 4L70E automatic transmission often have a worn-out accumulator piston pin bore or . If you are purchasing the transmission from a junkyard or rebuilt, its easier to get the parts with it. The pump introduced in the 4L60E is a variable displacement vane pump. This item: GM Genuine Parts 8680501 Automatic Transmission 2-4 Band Servo Pin. This specific clutch pack is known to have problems where the clutches burn due to slippage from oil leaking into the clutch pack. It seems these years were a dumping ground for leftover "stuff" I got a 95 with 78k on it and just finished puting it in. Similarly, the PCM also ramps down the LUF solenoid duty cycle to control TCC release. PSI sells Standalone Wiring Harnesses for GM Gen II, III, IV, & V LS/LT based engines and transmissions. Ive got an 06 behind a 5.3. What kind of changes did they make for towing? If it has a cable connection near the cooler lines on the passenger's side, that's a 700R4. Its meant to be used with rear-wheel drive and it requires 8.4 quarts of fluid. Here are a few examples of classic programming pitfalls: Setting incorrect parameters allows line pressure to drop off the mapping table to a minimum range when maximum pressure is required. Here is a more detailed list of the difference between the 4L60E and the 4L80E transmissions: With the model names so similar, you might think that these two automatic transmissions are similar, but they are actually quite different. 9005 vs. 9006 vs. H11 Differences & Are They be Interchangeable? can be reduced by properly cushioning the large ratio change on the 1-2 shift: Never use a 1-2 servo that eliminates the cushion spring. Is Your Transmission Fluid Leaking? This is to address the dreaded but all too common P1870 code? 4WD or 2WD application? Login to your account to access helpful features to expedite your checkout experience. The 4L60E has a 20-pin case connector on the passenger side behind the 2-4 servo as well. Always check band/pin adjustment to prevent band release problems. The 4L60E can come with either the 13-pin or 15-pin case plug. The valve body shown below includes repairs and improvements that typical of a 4L60/E performance build with some mileage and wear. Ships from and sold by Amazon.com. The illustrated instructions are here: The four resistors for the LEDs can be 330 to 390 , Watt. 732-276-8589Mon-Fri: 8:00am to 6:00pm ET Due to various bell housing & tail housing, all 2 piece units are shipped transmission section only. GM started making the 4L60E automatic overdrive transmission in the early 1990s in various configurations. GM V8 Tuning - Transmission Transmission NEWB New 13 pin 4L60e in truck with 15 pin connector Results 1 to 5 of 5 Thread: Transmission NEWB New 13 pin 4L60e in truck with 15 pin connector Thread Tools 02-02-2022 #1 raabdunn Potential Tuner Join Date Feb 2022 Location Tucson Posts 3 Transmission NEWB New 13 pin 4L60e in truck with 15 pin connector menu.init("menu","menuhover"); The 4L60E is controlled through 14 pins. Among the many things you should pay attention to, consider these vital parts. Remanufactured Pump Assembly Inc.Teflon Pump Bushing, 10 Vane Rotor Assembly, Hardened Rings & All Updates. The 4L60E transmission was a very popular transmission during its production and had been featured in many different types of vehicles, as well as in various automakers overseas. The 4L80E contains a pan that is oval, while the 4L60E has one that is shaped like a rectangle. There is an ID tag on the side of the transmission which can be decoded with the identifier below. Sonnax is an industry leader in the cutting edge design, manufacture and distribution of the highest quality products to the automotive aftermarket, commercial vehicle industries, and industrial sectors utilizing drivetrain technology. In fact, adding EXTRA magnets is a good idea, as they collect the hardest of contaminates most likely to effect the critical EPC solenoid. 1997 RCSB S10 - LQ4/4L80e swap - In progress. Your Guide to a Sonnax 4L60/E Level 3 Performance Build, 700-R4 (4L60) Performance Transmission Build Guide, The Evolution of Automatic Transmissions Part 2: Inner Workings of Hydraulic Planetary Transmissions, Smart-Tech Input Housing Kit with Heavy Duty Input Shaft, Adding friction surfaces reduces the amount of steel, Steel in the clutch pack helps dissipate heat, Without enough steel, heat builds up and clutches burn, Never use a 1-2 servo that eliminates the cushion spring, Never reduce the 1-2 accumulator piston stroke. You dont move when the input sprag fails, a critical link often overlooked during transmission upgrades. Get it as soon as Thursday, May 4. The TransGo 4L60E-HD2 kit comes with different rate springs depending on your servo size (LT1 cars all had the same Corvette servo from the factory, but I've seen rebuilds with a smaller servo, and there's no way to know without disassembling the servo to look at it). Its a great option if you have a heavy truck or need to push out maximum speeds. You can find a 4L60E in SUVs like the Chevrolet Suburban, muscle cars like the Corvette and even in sedans like the Holden Commodore made all the way down in Australia. In the, All solenoids share common 12V line on pin. I'd hate to burn up a trans towing, so what did they do??? Connectivity includes both Bluetooth and dual independent CAN bus networks. But overall, the most common one is the 13-pin connector with 13 wires. customerservice@psiconversion.com Stabilizing pressure starts with precise valve-to-bore clearances (PR valve bore wear is common in 4L60/E units) and a quality, leak-free boost valve. You may find some swap kits on the markets though. (626) 443-5247, 2621 Merced Avenue, El Monte, CA, 91733-1997 USA. Mechanically there are various differences which will affect strength and longevity, while electrically there are slight differences. Internally they are different, externally they look identical. Thats why it is paired with configurations that have a more powerful engine. Never shim the servo, as this moves the piston deeper into the bore where its more prone to bottoming out and causing band failure. When the mode switch is closed, auto mode will be used, regardless of what you do with the shift buttons. Now you have my curiosity as to if its a 4L70 or not. At idle (minimum throttle), the duty is at max (60%). Units produced in 2007 and later are 4L70E's indicated by a 15 pin connector versus the old 13 pin connector. If the transmission doesnt come with one, you can buy it on Amazon. In this guide, we will evaluate both transmissions and show you the differences. Its designed for the pickup truck with its die-cast aluminum casing. techsupport@psiconversion.com. Starting in 1999, LS engines had a 4L65E, indicated by having a top bolt hole at the 12 o'clock position. Its a model that was designed for high-performance functions, from towing and hauling to hot rodding. Its a well-intended tuning mistake that can lead to clutch-roasting pressure drops. Forced induction or not? Among 4WD configurations, it has one of the largest 32-line shafts. This can be identified by counting the metal pins sticking up from the round electrical connector on the transmission. Make sure the transmission pan has a drain plug, and change the fluid often to prevent micron-sized debris from undermining sprag engagement. For example, the 4L80E contains two-speed sensors, while the 4L60E has one. The Sonnax Smart-Tech housings apply and backing plates surround a larger clutch pack area to keep the clutches parallel and maximize protection against overheating. The OEM ECU then ramps the duty cycle up to approximately 50% to achieve regulated apply pressure in vehicles equipped with the Electronically Controlled Clutch Capacity (ECCC). All 4L60E's had a 4-pinion planetary gear train. Ensure that your transmission plug is inserted fully and in the correct orientation into the transmission. I have a 2006 Gen III L33 5.3 w/ 4L60E (13 pin connector) and Drive Range Selector mounted externally. Share. With either model, you get an electronically-controlled GM transmission. However, you can completely customize settings to your exact specifications. For a '94, yes your friend is right you need a non PWM (pulse width modulated) tranny. Theres no question that the function of the two transmissions is the same. We run you through a quick survey to determine exactly what plugs and cables you need for your specific 4L60E transmission and it's specific application.You'll get exactly the right kit. All 4L60E's were given the M30 designation for the RPO code. The pressure switch manifold (PSM) is a multiple switch assembly consisting of 3 normally open (NO) pressure switches and 2 normally closed (N/C) pressure switches. At WOT (wide open throttle), the duty is at min (0% or off). There is no cleaning pulse (dither) every 10 seconds on this transmission (unlike the 4L80E). Both transmissions hold a different amount of fluid, requiring its own dipstick to work properly. The easiest solution is to purchase a driveshaft of the appropriate length. Squeezing in more frictions requires installing a thinner backing plate with thinner clutches and steels, BUT: Adding more, thinner plates increases static holding capacity by sacrificing engaging capacity. Plus, we talk about how the two can be swapped. It contains an electronic ECU and has undergone a few upgrades throughout the years. No matter how well-built the unit, poor computer programming will quickly kill the transmission. 4L6-FWD Forward Head on over to ourdedicated pagefor more information on our 4L60E transmission controller. The table below shows a pin that is grounded by the PSM as a "0", while an open circuit shows a 12 (volts). In addition to wiring harnesses, PSI carries Holley Products, Vintage Air A/C, Dakota Digital Gauges, HPTuners and PCM programming, Fuel Pump Kits, Engine Sensors, Extension Harnesses, Replacement GM connector pigtails and a complete line of hardware to complete your conversion needs! Program your 4L60E shift strategy using the our World Firstsmart phone integrated transmission controller. On the other hand, the 4L60E might only cost $1,500. Since higher-stall aftermarket converters arent designed for continuous slip, it might seem reasonable to eliminate this function.

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